Transcription: Jamal Crawford on JJ Redick’s Podcast
This is a transcription of an episode of JJ Redick’s podcast on The Vertical, where Jamal Crawford came on to talk about their Clippers season and other things.
JJ) Welcome back to the Vertical podcast with JJ Redick. As i start this podcast realize that this will probably be the most difficult podcast that i’ll have to record this entire year. I’m recording this Saturday morning. We played last night in Portland, battered and bruised, and nearly came away with a win, but our season is over, and I’m fortunate enough to be joined by one of my teammates and one of my friends — Sixth Man of the Year, Jamal Crawford. Jamal, thanks for coming on the show today.
JC) Bubs! They don’t know about Bubs, but… anything for you. It’s a weird… space to be in… I know, for both of us and for our team. This is… it’s incredible.
JJ) Describe… from your perspective, describe the scene in the locker room. Kind of, you know, pre-Doc meeting, pre-media getting in there when it was just kind of the players and the realization that the season was over.
JC) It was one of the most emotional locker rooms that I’ve seen. I mean, people that you didn’t expect to cry, people… it was like all that was coming out. You know, like everything had came out… we literally poured our blood, sweat, and tears on that court. And it was an amazing feeling because we all felt the same way, you know? So it kind of took over the whole room. Still at a loss for words to see a guy like Paul Pierce crying. You know, this is a guy who won championships.
JJ) Right.
JC) To see him crying, and to see other people crying… and just… to hear Doc, and… Steve, and… to hear those guys getting choked up, it was something.
JJ) I think, you know, this season as a whole, it’s gonna take some time to process everything. But my initial reaction last night, was similar to what you were talking about, in the sense that… the whole season was an emotional rollercoaster.
JC) Yes.
JJ) It really was.
JC) Yes!
JJ) I mean, even going back to China…
JC) Yes.
JJ) You know, integrating new people and new personalities, Blake’s injury… you know, obviously Blake and Chris getting hurt in Game 4…. And it felt like to me, that maybe personally, maybe i had repressed some of those emotions?
JC) Yes
JJ) An I would say it seemed like a lot of the guys maybe repressed those emotions for the whole season. Because it did come out last night
JC) Yeah
JJ) When I got back to the locker room i just—
JC) …It all came out.
JJ) It all kinda came out at once. As soon as i got back to the locker room… I was probably the fourth or fifth guy off the court, and um… you know, I had to take some time for myself (laughs). You know, I wanted to be in the locker room when Doc got back, but I knew he was going to be delayed a little bit, so… i just went and stood in a bathroom stall for like 5, 10 minutes. And uh… and you know, i was emotional. And you come back in and you see everyone else crying, and…. Listen, I’ve been, and I’m sure you have too— really with the Clippers we’re going to talk about some more of that too— but I’ve been in some locker rooms at the end of the year where guys were crying, and I’ve been in locker rooms where they’re not crying, and I think it says a lot about the togetherness of the group when there’s that collective emotion.
JC) It really does, and we were a resilient group. If you look at everything we were faced with all year long, like you said from the beginning. In China, when we’re integrating new pieces and some of those new pieces is… butting heads with Chris…
JJ) You got hurt.
JC) Yes.
JJ) Austin got hurt.
JC) Austin got hurt.
JJ) Tooth knocked out in China
JC) Then we hear the news about Lamar.
JJ) Yeah.
JC) In China, right before…
JJ) Right before our second game. There was a… i don’t know what to call it but we had though that Lamar had passed. There was a report that Lamar had passed, and…
JC) No question we thought that, then we had to go play. Like we found that out literally…
JJ) 20 minutes before the game?
JC) 15, 20 minutes before we got on the court. So from the start of the season until now, like you said, it was like everything came out. I found myself last night, even after that on the plane, looking out the window I just broke down. (JJ laughs) Like I just broke down crying!
JJ) Yeah…
JC) I mean I’m not really an emotional person, honestly, but it just… like you said, everything came out.
JJ) So that people understand… because we do play a game.
JC) Yes.
JJ) At it’s core, basketball is a game. But the reality is that in the NBA the stakes are a little bit higher than that childhood game that we all grew up playing and we all grew up loving. Just describe the investment. And I think that’s where that emotion comes from. It’s because there is a lot of sacrifice. Family, time, all that. Just describe that investment that guys make.
JC) There’s so much… and you know what, not only the investment and the sacrifice not only on our parts but on our family’s parts. Like, think about it. Chelsea and Knox, they don’t see you as much as they could or should. You know, and same with my kids and my family. And my wife knows in the season she pretty much has to hold down everything. You know, because during the season I’m so invested— I’m foam rolling, I’m taking salt baths, I’m watching what’s going on with this game or that game…
JJ) You’re not drinking Capri Sun.
JC) I’m not drinking my Capri Sun!
JJ) That’s a major sacrifice.
JC) That’s a HUGE sacrifice for me. The candy jar next to the bed has to have a lock on it for a while so that me and my kids don’t break it open…. But it’s just, it’s so many different things, and missing games for my son, or not being able to go to his field trip or pick him up from school. Those little things… We give so much of ourselves to our game and to our teammates. And so… it really is a family because we’re all sacrificing those same things..
JJ) So we all understand that. The extra work, the extra time, the time away from family. The group dynamic tooI think is important. I think that’s where a lot of the emotion comes too, because… I’m not going to equate sports to death, there’s all this sort of cliches and ufaeisims about “do or die” games and all that stuff. But in a sense our group, that group, passed away last night. In a sense.
JC) In a sense.
JJ) And we spent, going back to China and training camp, we spent just about everyday together, all over the world. We fought together, we battled together. And then you come to that realization that… there’s that gratefulness and you appreciate it, but there’s also that realization that there’s some guys that you may never play with, that you may never be teammates again.
JC) You came here three years ago. When we signed you, I’m like “Aw man, JJ Redick. I’ve seen him in the Playoffs in Atlanta. What kind of guy is this guy?” You know, like we’re going to be going at it in training camp, and… You know what I mean? Contrast of styles, both effective, both… but different, so I’m like, “How’s this going to work? We’re going to go at it.” I remember you were guarding me, I wouldn’t guard you at first. Remember that?
JJ) (laughing) Yeah
JC) Remember that? I wouldn’t guard you at first. I was like “no, no no, I gotta feel him out a little bit more.” That was three years ago.
JJ) I know…
JC) It goes so fast, and the windows, and if you look at how we’ve lost in these Playoffs the last three years, they’ve been so dramatic. So gut wrenching in a way. This one, out of all the three that you’ve been here with, I can honestly say that it was not self-inflicted. It was not like something that we could control that would…
JJ) Right…
JC) …we brought this on ourselves type of thing. We weathered the storm, we battled. Who can lose their two best guys…
JJ) No one!
JC) In a Playoff series?
JJ) Yeah, no one.
JC) At the same time, in the same game. And still have a chance, still have a shot. I can’t think of any other team that could do that.
JJ) Before we move on, two things I wanna say. Number one, I know you’ll agree with me on this: you gotta give Portland credit.
JC) Yeah.
JJ) They played their asses off.
JC) Yes, they did.
JJ) And based on what happened in Games 1 and 2 they made some great adjustments. They figured out ways to get Lillard and MacCollum space even though we were blitzing them and double teaming them a lot. And you also have to credit their role-players.
JC) They stepped up.
JJ) Al-Faruq Aminu had a great game in Portland. I think that was Game 4, right? When he had 30?
JC) Yeah, Game 4.
JJ) And then Mo Harkless last night hit 3 threes in the 3rd quarter, I mean, so… and our game plan was that we were gonna be in our full body help against Harkless and in that 3rd quarter he made his pay. So you gotta give them credit. The other thing from last night, was Austin Rivers’ gutsy performance. I don’t know that I’ve seen that as a teammate. It was… I don’t want to hype it up too much, but it was inspiring.
JC) No question it was inspiring. It… his eye, so when he goes out, I’m like “Ok… I see the blood but he could also have a concussion.”
JJ) It was gory, by the way.
JC) Oh, it was like a boxer who just did 12 rounds with Mayweather or Pacquiao, like it was BAD. And it got worse as the game went on. I see him check back in the game. His eye is closed. He’s kind of playing with one eye. And he’s playing against one of the best players in the NBA in Lillard, and battling him. And you hear the comments, I hear the comments, we all hear the comments about “oh he’s here just because of his father” and you know, all that other stuff.
JJ) He’s been an easy punching bag.
JC) Yes.
JJ) For whatever reason. And probably some of that has to do a little bit with his lineage and like you said, with Doc, but… that kid is tough, man.
JC) And nobody could ever question that. I think he gained everybody who ever said anything about him negative, last night, they looked at him totally different, and I doubt they’ll ever say anything negative about him again.
JJ) He won over a lot of fans. You know, I’ve felt a certain way about Austin for a long time now, and I know how tough he is. I told him last night, “I respected you before, but it just went to a different level.”
JC) And think about that! This is somebody we see everyday. So imagine the casual fan from afar, saying or having their little feelings, saying their little lines with their eggs as their avis on Twitter and stuff like that. It’s totally different now.
JJ) Someone the other day on Twitter… I can’t remember what they said to me. It was a… I think it was a UNC fan made a comment, and I never respond to things, but it was an egg. And I just said him, man, I was like, whatever he said, it was something about UNC, and I said “You know what, I’ll do it. When you get an actual avatar”
JC) “Show your face! Show yourself!”
JJ) He said he was working too hard.
JC) Yeah right. Reveal yourself! Some of those people, they’re the ones who’ll throw a stone and hide their hands.
JJ) Overall though I would say, we had a good season. But again, it’s frustrating to have a chance…. And I don’t… look, thinking about moving ahead against Golden State or San Antonio, OKC, getting to the Eastern Conference… I don’t know how those series play out if we’re fully healthy, but I do think we had a chance. And at least for me, being here three years, I feel like we had a chance every year. Every year it’s like, I don’t know if it’s that WE find a different way, but we’ve certainly lost in the most gut wrenching of ways.
JC) Yes.
JJ) And I don’t know that they’re all connected. I would like to think they’re not connected… What’s your feeling on that?
JC) I would like to think they’re not connected. But, like I said, if you stay with a team for eight years you MAY go through these situations once or twice. We’ve gone through them consecutively, years in a row. And that’s where the problem lies. That’s why people are like “how much longer is this group gonna stay together?” “how much more can this group take?” “how much more can we take as fans going through this?” (JJ laughing) So you know, it all ties together.
JJ) That’s true. That true… Do you think that when the Clippers did the rebrand they should have just got rid of the Clippers name? Is it a curse?
JC) The Clippers curse out there? I’m not sure it’s a curse. I don’t wanna say it’s a curse but…
JJ) I don’t believe in that stuff!
JC) Yeah, I don’t believe in it…
JJ) …but now I’m like…
JC) Things are just…
JJ) Man…
JC) It’s not one two three four, it’s not just abc either. Something’s… there. Like something… it’s not a curse, but it’s something.
JJ) How do you feel about this name: The Los Angeles Fame
JC) We got some famous guys on our team. Los Angeles Fame… I’m not against it.
JJ) You can do the “LA Stars”. The Los Angeles Stars.
JC) The LA Stars. If that’s going to change our outcome
JJ) I think it’s too late.
JC) Yeah right?
JJ) I’ll talk to Balmer.
JC) If that’s going to change our outcome, then I’m all for it.
JJ) You feel for so many people, obviously Chris and Blake being out, and all the people that we work with on a day to day basis. Our trainers, our coaches, Denise, there’s Ta’Nisha…
JC) There’s so much people that work behind the scenes.
JJ) I know. You wanna win for those people too. And you wanna win for your fans. The people that show up every night, people that watch the games on League Pass…
JC) Yes.
JJ) I think that’s part of the emotion too, it’s like… I texted my brother this morning, I said “Man, I just feel like I let a lot of people down.” And listen, it’s not like I wasn’t trying. I was out there with the right intention. But that’s the feeling you get. You feel like you let people down.
JC) And from a distance it’s so easy to say “hey they lost” and “they’ll get over it”. You know. It’s so many emotions that go into this. One minute you can find yourself like you can turn on the sports channel. The next minute you don’t wanna watch any sports. You know? One minute you’re like “hey ok, I’ll be ok, I’m with my son, I’ll be fine”. The next minute you like “I just want to be by myself”. There’s so many emotions that go into this because you gave our all. And like you say, those people behind the scenes, there’s people that get to the gym at 6, 7 in the morning just to cut filmwork to make sure we have enough information on who we’re playing. You know, all those people. It’s incredible.
JJ) It really is. There’s a lot that goes into it and a lot of people have put into it. From Jamal and I, thank you.
JC) Thank all you guys.
JJ) Clippers Nation, thank you.
JC) Thank you. We know you guys will hear this.
JJ) And thank you to… I mean really, I love the NBA. I love the fact that we have fans all over the world and… Even though you and I are not in it, you and I are fans of the game.
JC) Yes.
JJ) I may not watch Game 1 and 2 of the next series (JC laughing) but I’ll come around and I’ll watch some more basketball this spring… It’s really to me, it’s the greatest game out there and it brings me kind of to my next point. I heard that Wes Johnson afterwards… I didn’t know who he was talking to, I was kind of in an adjacent room. Back corner of the locker room. He was talking to someone and he said “This was the best group I’ve been a part of. And not even close.” And he’s been in the league seven years. And you’re kind of touched on that. You’re four years with the Clippers… I guess there’s just a real sense of gratitude, and a gratefulness to be a part of THIS.
JC) This is special. I’ve been in the league 16 years. And the Clippers have felt like home and a family more than any other place I’ve ever been. I was going to ask you that, actually. ‘Coz you’ve been in the Playoffs a lot of times. Orlando, and…
JJ) I haven’t missed the Playoffs, by the way.
JC) Wow. I didn’t know that. I didn’t know THAT.
JJ) I like to point that out. If there ever comes a time in my podcast… This is about the fourth time I’ve mentioned that (laughs). 10 for 10, fam. 10 for 10.
JC) That’s unbelievable. I didn’t go till my tenth year. On the opposite end of the spectrum. That’s amazing…
JC) So you’re with the Clippers and you’ve been here three years now. In this segment (?), you’ve been to the finals, you’ve lost in the first round, you’ve been everywhere in between. How does this rank for you, as far as the Playoff exits, the disappointment? Because everyone is disappointed at some level, you know? Whether it’s the first round, you lose in the finals… How does this rank in this last three years compared to the first seven years of the Playoffs?
JJ) Well, it’s difficult… I’m sure you’ll agree with this but it’s difficult when you’re younger to really see the big picture. And you know, you lose in the finals in your third year and…
JC) You think you’re going back all the time.
JJ) Dwight’s under contract for four more years, Jameer is under contract for four more years, Rashard under contract…. So you think you’d be back every year. We lose in the Conference Finals in the next year…. That to me was the hardest year in Orlando, because that team was really close. And that was also I think our best team, in 2010. We lost to Doc and the Celtics. So that was hard. But then you get older, and you know, at this point now, with the Clippers I’ve been married the whole time…
JC) Right.
JJ) I got a kid now.
JC) Different appreciation.
JJ) You have a totally different appreciation. And the relationships as a whole, I certainly had made some great relationships in Orlando but the relationships as a whole in Los Angeles are the best relationships that I’ve built in the NBA. So each of these has hurt differently. I think each of the last three seasons has hurt differently. And for you, because you were here four years and I know you guys had a tough series against Memphis. Up 2-0 and Blake gets hurt and you end up losing that series. Is there one that stands out more than the other? Or do they all hurt equally?
JC) That’s a good question because they all hurt equally, but this one was DIFFERENT. From the stand point of, it was like I said, it wasn’t like, self-inflicted. It wasn’t like we were up 2-0 and lost 4 straight with everybody healthy, like we did against Memphis. It wasn’t like 2-2 up 7 with 40 seconds left on the road in Portland, and we lose that game. Right? And then ultimately lose the series. It wasn’t like we were up 3-1 and then lose the series when we’re this close to the Western Finals. So every one hurts differently, but this one was like, “What can happen next?”. To lose those two guys in the middle of a Playoff series… when there’s no time to recover, you know, it’s not like it happened in the first week of the season. Everyone hurts differently but this one is just a little bit different from the other ones.
JJ) This one hurts. Last year was tough.
JC) Last year was tough.
JJ) To be that close. You and I have been…
JC) We even talked…
JJ) We even talked about it!
JC) We even talked about it! So you guys know that I only went to college for a year, and I played half a season. (laughs) So JJ is telling me what it’s like to get to the Final Four. And we’re talking about it.
JJ) To get to the Conference Finals, to be one of the last four teams.
JC) Right. And you compared it to the Final Four.
JJ) Right, I compared it to the Final Four.
JC) And you said that the Final Four didn’t hold a candle to being in the Conference Finals with just those four teams. And we talked about it when we were up 3-1. And we NEVER…
JJ) It was a brief conversation…
JC) It was very brief…
JJ) This is not something.. It was not like we said “oh, we were there”…
JC) Yeah I know.
JJ) But…we were so close.
JC) And we talked about it as motivation. Like, if we can just win this next game…. And then that was when you started talking about what it would be like. It was not like we ever overlooked anybody. We were definitely in the moment. But it was just… to be that close and then to lose THAT dramatically. And then even in Game 6, be up 19 at home, going into the 4th quarter…. I think I honestly think you can replay that a hundred times and 99 times it would have worked in our favor. to be up NINETEEN. That’s the one time I felt like… it would have bit us in the ass and it did.
JJ) It did! It did…. So we’re gonna let Doc the GM figure out the future of the Clippers.
JC) Yes.
JJ) I always… anytime the media ever asks me about that, I’m always like “My job is a basketball player. I’m not… I have no suggestions on that”. I really don’t. I enjoy playing basketball, that’s Doc’s job, he’ll figure it out. But part of that future is your upcoming free agency. What is your mindset right now going into this summer? Because as you said, this has been some of the best years of your career. I mean, I assume you want to be back.
JC) No question about it. I talked to my wife about it and she brought up a good point. We’ve been together 10 years. And she said, “This is the longest that we’ve ever lived in one place together”. So we’ve been on the move whether it was Atlanta, or New York, or Golden State or Portland. This has been the longest stretch, and she enjoys that. She enjoys the stability. I enjoy the stability from our team. Us two, Blake, CP, DJ have all been together 3 plus years. Those guys even 5 or 6 years. So I enjoy that part of it. I know my role, I respect my role, I respect my teammates. I don’t like change. I don’t like change, so I’m very very comfortable here, and I would love to stay here and further…. You know, some people are like “I wanna retire here”. I’m not even thinking about retiring, so I just wanna continue my career.
JJ) Well you’re Benjamin Button so you’re gonna play till…
JC) I wanna continue my career.
JJ) You’re gonna play till you’re 50.
JC) No question.
JJ) Yeah, I think it’s interesting you say that. I’m kind of wired the same way. Change is not necessarily a good thing
JC) No.
JJ) Especially when you’re actually enjoying the process and…. One of the interesting things you said to me earlier today, when we were trying to get the wifi up and working (both laugh)… which took 45 minutes but the way…
JC) Yes it did.
JJ) Um…. You gave me the wrong wifi… but whatever. One of the things you said to me was the idea of THIS group, of this core group of guys finally breaking through… that feeling…
JC) Would mean everything. Because we’ve been through hell!
JJ) There’s a lot of people that look at our team and think, there’s something fundamentally wrong with their core….
JC) No no no no. Us, and San Antonio are the only teams over the last four years to have consecutive 50 win seasons. There’s nothing wrong with our core. We just had a string of back luck in some ways… Shit!
JJ) Some of them self inflicted.
JC) Some of them were self inflicted. Some of it some bad luck! And to break through with THIS core group, would mean everything. Because we’ve… it feels like, I hope nothing happens next year, but it feels like we’ve seen the worst of the worst. And the one thing about the NBA is that chemistry is underrated to me.
JJ) I agree, I agree.
JC) Look at the ‘80s. Teams stood together 7, 8, 9, 10 years. You look at the Celtics, it was Bird, it was McHale, it was Ainge, it was Parrish, it was DJ. You go the Lakers, it was Magic, Kareem, Byron Scott, Worthy…
JJ) What if Utah decided to break up Stockton and Malone?
JC) You know what I mean?
JJ) Would they have made the Finals? Probably not, right?
JC) No fucking way! Like, you have to go through things. You know? and I think sometimes you have to go through the rain to get to the rainbow. And we’re going through the rain! We’re going through it! And we’re gonna get to the rainbow, I have faith!
JJ) There goes one of the Jamal euphemisms (laughs).
JC) See? I was saving one. I was saving one for you (laughs).
JJ) What was the one you used the other day? I can’t remember what we were talking about but something you saw, you thought would be appealing to me.
JC) It was a watch or something.
JJ) A watch or… maybe like a…
JC) A certain coat, it was something…
JJ) Yeah, maybe like a… nice bomber jacket or something.
JC) Yeah it might have been.
JJ) And what did you say?
JC) I saw your eyes light up first. And I said, “Bubs. If you had an alley, that would be right up yours”.
JJ) Yeah. I love it. That’s a Jamal euphemism. Alright. So, you’re a free agent this summer. You’re coming off of a great year for you, personally.
JC) I think it was honestly, from top to bottom if you include the whole thing and you know, revamping the bench and everything, It think it was actually one of my better years.
JJ) Yeah.
JC) Yeah, I really do.
JJ) And you were awarded with that.
JC) Yes. You called that pretty early.
JJ) You were awarded that award. Sixth Man of the Year. It’s interesting to me, you know, last summer, you were frustrated with… kind of the pieces that were brought in and how that would fit with your game. I know you and Doc had a bunch of conversations and not all of them were friendly. And it’s interesting to me to see kind of how things worked out. I’ll say this…
JC) I’ll never have bet this bro.
JJ) And you ended up winning Sixth Man of the Year.
JC) I would have never…. It wasn’t even on my radar. Like, at all. Because like you said, the pieces that were coming in, I felt like… I just didn’t know how they would fit. And I felt like there was some of what I did, but… you know, so I was like, how does my role change? How does it now? And the conversations, like you said, were not always the friendliest but we had to talk it out. And we had to get through it because…. This is what I’m fighting, right? So, I’m thinking, as you get older, human nature is like oh, well he’s older than he was a year ago, his numbers are obviously going to come down because these pieces, they’re going to say, oh he’s slowing down.
JJ) Yeah you get phased out.
JC) Yeah, you get phased out. Right, so I’m thinking that…
JJ) Going into a contract year. I understand. This is human nature, man.
JC) Yeah! Yeah…
JJ) This is something that’s… You gotta provide for your family. I get that man . It’s all good.
JC) It’s all connected. And I’m just like “wow, not only that, I feel like Im sacrificing because your guys’ unit have pretty much been together. You guys know each other. I’m like the second unit that has to keep revamping, you know. Keep changing and it just… I didn’t know how it would fit. So I didn’t know how it would work.
JJ) I think there were some growing pains initially with our second unit. And I said this early on in the season, I said “look it’s fine that we’ve added these pieces…”
JC) Yeah you did say that.
JJ) And…. I mean, talented guys. Talented guys, for real. Talented guys. But I said it doesn’t matter who’s on the court with Jamal, we need to play through Jamal…
JC) You said that.
JJ) And eventually we figured that out. And I think too, Austin really grew in his role.
JC) He grew a lot. His game grew a lot. I told him that.
JJ) Yeah.
JC) I was proud of him. Even before the Playoffs, like, he grew. From seeing him at the beginning of the season to the end, he grew. He’s a totally different player.
JJ) And y’all have nice chemistry for the second half of the year. Pablo, and Cole…
JC) Cole! They were huge too. They were huge. Like I won the award but that doesn’t happen if those guys don’t come in the mix. If we don’t jam like that, and don’t fit like that. They were just as responsible for winning it as me.
JJ) From a historical context I know you love the game…
JC) Love it.
JJ) …and study it.
JC) Yes.
JJ) I’m gonna blow up your spot a little bit.
JC) Go for it.
JJ) Because you…. This one meant a lot to you. Being the first person to win this award three times… it was on your radar. You thought about this, you wanted this. I think you deserved it. But this was probably more important than…
JC) The other two?
JJ) The other two. I mean, just… it was.
JC) It definitely was. No question about it. This Sixth Man meant more than the other two because to start the season, it wasn’t even on my radar. I knew at some point I wanted to get another one, but this season I was like “Ah, well.. we brought in Josh, we brought in Lance. You know, Austin’s here. We brought in Cole, we brought in Paul Pierce, we brought in Pablo… we brought in Luke the day of going to training camp…. I’m like, there’s no way. So it wasn’t on my radar. It didn’t really come into fruition I think until later on. I mean, January, February, I’m like “…I think this could happen”. You know? But this one meant more because like you said, being a student of the game, to be the first to do anything when there’s so many great players that have played basketball… When there’s so many talented guys who have never made the NBA…. So to do certain from a historic standpoint I think is… pretty crazy.
JJ) You’re approaching 20,000 points. Assuming you play another…
JC) Yes. An average 11 points next 20 odd seasons, yeah (laughs).
JJ) I know you’ve figured all this stuff out. But no, I mean…. To get to that, to win this Sixth Man award 3 times…. You’ve had a pretty career man.
JC) Pretty decent.
JJ) How much longer, realistically…
JC) Come on!
JJ) You don’t have to put a number on it.
JC) I can.
JJ) But how much longer…. You think everything out. You’re OCD. Let’s go, how much longer are you going to play?
JC) Five years.
JJ) Five?
JC) Five years.
JJ) So you’re going to play until you’re 41.
JC) See, that’s the problem! That’s where guys get in trouble, when they start being like “I’m 41”. I’m gonna be playing at 41 at LA Fitness. Why not play at 41 against the best players in the world if I still can? Why not?
JJ) That’s what Steve Nash told me. He told me the same thing.
JC) And that’s one of the best players in the….
JJ) “If I had a chance to play in the NBA, why not?”
JC) Why not?
JJ) You’re not going to be able to do it for the rest of your life.
JC) That’s it. I’ve played… I have pictures, I’ll show you. I’ve played since I was two years old. I had basketball in my hands. So I’ve basically played for the last… 34 years. Like, I’ve given my life to this. What’s 5 more years?
JJ) That’s true.
JC) What’s 5 more years?
JJ) In terms of thinking about how much longer I want to play, the family equation…
JC) I was about to ask you that though.
JJ) I would say 5 more years too, which…. I got next year on my contract, I would like a 4 year deal after that. And that’d be 15 years.
JC) And you’ll get it.
JJ) I hope so. But no, part of it is the family thing, so it’s…. You know, we talked about sacrifice, and I feel like I’m missing opportunities. Every time I’m on the road…
JC) For sure.
JJ) … Chelsea sends me a Snap Chat of Knox doing something, and… I feel bad. I got another one on the way. You also have…
JC) Another one on the way.
JJ) Another one on the way.
JC) Yes.
JJ) Your wife Tory told me something very interesting about you.
JC) What did she say?
JJ) And I want you to confirm this.
JC) Oh man… I’m denying it already. What did she say?
JJ) She said that you’ve never changed a dirty diaper. Meaning like a number 2. You’ve never changed a dirty diaper?
JC) See, that’s NOT true…. It’s very rare! It’s very rare. My daughter, no. (laughs) ….So maybe she’s talking about my daughter. My daughter, no, I’ve never changed her dirty diaper.
JJ) So just for JJ.
JC) Just JJ. But girls are a little different.
JJ) I understand that. But she said to me, that every time she’ll say something like “Oh, the diaper needs to be changed”…
JC) I have barbecue on my hands. She told you that? (laughs)
JJ) She told… Yes! That’s exactly what she said! You’re eating ribs! You’re eating ribs.
JC) Because one time I was eating some barbecue. And… I couldn’t do it! So now I could be eating a piece of candy. “I have barbecue on my hands! I can’t do it.” She told you that?
JJ) I know you’re a good father. I’m only reaming (ribbing?) you a little bit.
JC) Yeah yeah, I know. Of course! Let me…. So going back, you said you want to play 5 more years?
JJ) Yeah.
JC) Do you see how fast these three years just went by?
JJ) Oh, so fast.
JC) And you’re sure you only want to play 5 more years?
JJ) I think I gotta concentrate on 1 year at a time…. Because the idea of playing 5 more years seems daunting. I mean it really does!
JC) It does seem daunting.
JJ) You know, the emotional, the physical toll….
JC) Yeah. Everything that goes into it.
JJ) We were just talking earlier! My body feels like shit right now!
JC) Yeah.
JJ) Maybe you play all these games, and you just get to the point, you know, by the Playoffs you’re just managing a bunch of…
JC) Yeah. Everybody is.
JJ) Everybody is. I’m not saying me…
JC) No, no, no, yeah. Everybody is.
JJ) Everybody’s got something going on.
JC) But then you take the month, two, three months off, and you get refreshed and you’re like….
JJ) And you start training in the summer, and your body feels great….
JC) You start thinking about hitting those game-winning threes… And the crowd…. It’s such a rush.
JJ) Yeah….
JC) 5 years for you?
JJ) I think if I had a goal for this summer, I think my goal would be to just re… not that I’m not in love with basketball, but to RE fall in love.
JC) Yeah.
JJ) To experience that honeymoon with basketball. To get down to the, like poetic,…
JC) The essence of it.
JJ) The essence of why I love the game.
JC) And you know what, and I use that to segway to this other part of the conversation…. You have been requested at the JC Seattle (?)… (JJ laughs) And I’m serious, people want to see you! You have such a following out there! From Duke all the way…. They want you to come play. In the ProAm. ONCE.
JJ) I don’t play pickup…
JC) ONCE!
JJ) (laughs)
JC) We will set up the… Aye! One time!
JJ) …Alright.
JC) Maybe even if you come and do the three point contest.
JJ) When is this going on?
JC) July to September. Maybe if you just come do the three point contest. They just want to see you!
JJ) Alright (reluctantly)
JC) For the All Star Weekend? Maybe it’s the three point contest.
JJ) Alright (huge sigh)
JC) We can jet ski up there, we can hang out on the water….
JJ) Are you going to fly me out?
JC) Of course! Are you serious? Of course!
JJ) PJ? Are we going private jet?
JC) For you, yes.
JJ) You know what? This will be after Free Agency so if you get a nice deal…. I’m going to hold you to it.
JC) For you, yes.
JJ) (laughs)
JC) Let me ask you this. Life after basketball.
JJ) Yeah.
JC) You are so focused and driven and so detailed. You already have to have something on mind about what you’re thinking about.
JJ) I do. And I’ve talked about it on the podcast a little bit before. I think for me, the most important thing is to find something that I’m equally as passionate about as basketball. And that may be a challenge. As you’ve said, we’ve given our lives to this game. I mean, watching Kobe Bryant play that last game and what he talked about afterwards…. I mean, that guy gave his life to the game of basketball. And so… yeah, it’s going to be a challenge for him or anybody who loved the game like we do. It’s going to be a challenge to find something. But I don’t play basketball for money. Like, I really don’t. I don’t love the game because of money.
JC) Right.
JJ) And so post career, for me it’s not finding something where I earn a lot of money, it’s about finding something that I love to do.
JC) And it keeps you happy.
JJ) Which for you it’s gonna be something in basketball, I assume (laughs).
JJ) Oh no question. For me, I think it’ll be something along broadcasting. Or something along front office, even if I was a scout or something. Because I love to watch basketball. I love to try to put teams and stuff together in my head. Play fake GM, things of that nature. So I think something around the game, for sure. Not coaching! But something else.
JJ) I don’t know if you’ve been paying attention to this. I’m assuming you have, but I recently saw that there was an issue, a vote on the stadium in Seattle. I guess the Mariners wanted some sort of guarantee of scheduling with this new arena that Chris Hansen’s trying to…
JC) I know Chris. Chris is actually from my area, like right there.
JJ) That would be a dream for you, I assume.
JC) (Sighs)
JJ) If Seattle got a team, and you could work for that team. You don’t want to leave Seattle.
JC) No! I want to be there until it’s over with. But Chris and I have talked about that. And that would be unbelievable. Hopefully it happens. We want it… we thought honestly that Sacramento was going to come up there.
JJ) Kevin Johnson.
JC) Yeah. He pulled some magic.
JJ) He did (laughs).
JC) He pulled some magic! Kevin Johnson’s like Magic Johnson. He pulled some magic on that one.
JJ) Alright Jamal. For this week’s 4 on 4, we’re gonna be talking about our 4 favorite musical acts of all time. And this is in honor of the great Prince.
JC) Yeah.
JJ) Rest in peace.
JC) Rest in peace.
JJ) Very sad.
JC) Certain people, honestly, it’s like…it makes everything like, like we’re all mortal. Prince is like, supposed to be like this…
JJ) Mmm hmm.
JC) …figure, that’s supposed to almost be like…. People like him, Sade, Michael Jackson, Springsteen… All these people are like, they’ve been the backdrops of our lives. So it’s almost like they’ve been here as long as we’ve been here. It’s almost like they’ve been here in the 1600’s or something. They’ve been here forever.
JJ) Right.
JC) So to hear certain people pass away, that’s just…. it’s hard to even fathom.
JJ) Your first memories of any sort of pop culture…. At least for me, when I first started watching MTV or BET when I was growing up…. We didn’t have cable until I was like 11 years old so this is probably like 1994, 95. But you know… Prince!
JC) Yes.
JJ) Or the artist formally known as Prince. Around that time.
JC) I remember Purple Rain. And If you’ve seen the movie, he’s got his motorcycle, he’s running through, splashing up water everywhere doing these tricks. After I saw Purple Rain— it rains a lot in Seattle, obviously— I’d go outside on my bike. I think I’m Prince in my mind, I’m on a motorcycle in my mind. So I’m doing little tricks on my bike thinking I’m Prince, like this is how Prince did it. And that was one of my first memories of Prince. Purple Rain, the movie.
JJ) So Prince is not on your top 4 musical acts of all time, but you do appreciate greatness.
JC) Yes. He would be, but he’s not that I listened to, as my top 4.
JJ) Ok. So we’ll go one at a time. Let’s start with your favorite. I wanna know your favorite. Your favorite musical act of all time.
JC) Tupac Shakur.
JJ) Ooh. That’s a great choice.
JC) That’s a GREAT choice. To think that he didn’t get a chance to grow to where he was going… to see his growth from 21 to 25… And he passed at 25, so. And everything he meant… There’s people doing life in jail who have Tupac posters on their wall right now. Like he was so much bigger than just music.
JJ) His influence is crazy. And it’s interesting to listen to his rap music. It’s timeless.
JC) Yes.
JJ) Whereas if you listen to some rap from the ‘90s…
JC) It sounds outdated.
JJ) It’s like “What the hell? What is this? What is this??” It’d be interesting to see if Tupac had ever done a collaboration with like, a Kanye production.
JC) Ugh!
JJ) It’d be insane!
JC) Somebody we’re going to talk about later on the list is Nas. There’s this song called “Thugz Mansion”.
JJ) Yeah. Oh yeah.
JC) Tupac’s verse wass from 1996. Nas is 2003. Tupac still sounds better on the verse. I’m like, this is incredible. He was calling out the Nas’ and Jay Z’s of this world.
JJ) Was that the “Better Dayz” album?
JC) Yes. It was.
JJ) That was one of my favorite albums.
JC) People weren’t even responding!
JJ) I love that album.
JC) People weren’t even responding! Biggie, Jay Z, Nas, these were the all-time greats. They weren’t even responding to Tupac. That shows how far and above away he was. They didn’t even wanna mess with him.
JJ) Tupac is not my favorite ever…
JC) But he’s in your…
JJ) But he’s number 2. Number 1 for me is Bruce Springsteen. And the reason is…
JC) “Born in the USA”?
JJ) (laughing) No… He just had such.… His music was all I listened to when I was in college. And this was when Kazaa and the…. What was the… Napster?
JC) Napster, yeah
JJ) The one you could illegally download music?
JC) Yes.
JJ) Oh, I had SO many Bruce Springsteen albums! But I also physically bought every one of his albums. And I love him. And to this day, still the best concert I’ve ever seen. I actually saw him in concert at UNC’s football stadium.
JC) Wow.
JJ) I went with the Krzyzewski Family. He had played the night before in Washington DC, got on the bus, drove the 4 hours down, performed for 3 1/2 hours. And he performed like it was the last show he was ever going to perform, AND the first show. It was brilliant. It was brilliant.
JC) I read something Michael Jordan said, he played the same way. Because there might be some people in the crowd who’s never seen him before. And he doesn’t wanna disappoint them. That sounds like what happened with Bruce.
JJ) Yeah. My first exposure to him too was the Rising album, which was sort of the first rock album post 9-11 that dealt with the emotions that all Americans really were going through. And so that really resonated with me. So I got two. Give me another one after Tupac.
JC) Michael Jackson.
JJ) (sighs)…. Michael Jackson.
JC) Have we ever seen anyone more famous? Have we ever see anybody that was 5 to 50 years old that was a more famous person on the planet? You could put a silhouette of this guy up, and you know exactly who it was.
JJ) Yup.
JC) All over the world. Not even just the country. People faint when they saw him. He was so…. I know you’re a detailed guy. He was the most detailed I’d ever seen when it came to his dancing and his choreography, everything. He is such an inspiration to everybody.
JJ) It’s interesting to see his influence in his…You said it, inspiration. I mean, I’ve had teammates in basketball who are obsessed with Michael Jackson. Do you know who Shavlik Randolph is?
JC) Yes. He played in Philadelphia for a while right?
JJ) Yeah, he was with me at Duke, and he had every Michael Jackson outfit. He could do all the dances… obsessed!
JC) Michael is…. I don’t think we’ll ever see anyone more famous than him. I really don’t. In our lifetime or anybody else’s lifetime.
JJ) You mentioned Nas…. For me, that’s like after Tupac is my second favorite rapper. I love Jay Z, and this is not…. we’re not doing a whole podcast about Jay Z vs Nas. I’m not going to get into that with you. Because I know Jay Z is on your list. I just love Nas. And I love his delivery, I love his lyrics…. You may not know this— actually you do know this because I think I still owe you a listen— but you know, I did some real poor amateur rap music in college….
JC) Yeah I do know this. (inaudible) Yeah I know this.
JJ) I think Nas probably influenced my lyrics more than anyone. I love Nas.
JC) Nas is definitely a top 5 rapper ever, and he’s still underrated. Think about that.
JJ) He is underrated.
JC) He’s STILL underrated. Because he’s not in it for… like you said, you don’t play basketball for the money. He’s not in it for the limelight or the fame. He’s really trying to…. He makes time to….
JJ) He’s about his craft.
JC) Period.
JJ) He’s about his craft.
JC) Period.
JJ) I respect him.
JC) I know people that have talk to him. They say he’s one of the most brilliant people they’ve ever talked to as well.
JJ) So 3 for you. I just said it.
JC) Jay Z. Has there ever been anybody THAT good for THAT long? 20 years. At the top of the game. This guy had everybody wearing jerseys…
JJ) If you turn to rap music there’s no one that has ever done what he has done in terms of longevity and quality.
JC) At that level, no.
JJ) AND influence. Pop culture influence. He’s so relevant TODAY. Same when he was, you can argue in his prime, late ‘90s early 2000’s. He’s still as relevant today.
JC) Period. This guy brought us throwback jerseys. Then he killed throwback jerseys with button-ups. Then he put on a suit. Then he…. This guy was a guy from Marcy Projects!
JJ) Tom Ford owes him substantial commission.
JC) Yes! Unbelievable! Then he has the most famous female on his side.
JJ) Oh my gosh (sighs).
JC) …Who she’s said in the past, and I’ve known this, he inspired her before they even started dating. So it’s like, the guy can do no wrong!
JJ) I’m surprised Beyonce is not on your list.
JC) She actually should be.
JC) But number 4 is also a female performer for you.
JC) Yes, the best voice I’ve ever heard in my life. Whitney Houston.
JJ) (sighs)
JJ) Her voice…. Did you hear the anthem?
JJ) I didn’t.
JC) Have you heard that “Star Spangled Banner”? At the Super Bowl?
JJ) Nah… I don’t think I have.
JC) She has this sweatsuit on. Her voice sounds like an instrument. It sounds like something you can play or buy to listen to. It doesn’t sound like actually someone singing that. It’s almost fake. Nobody’s voice should sound like that. It’s breathtaking! You need to listen to that!
JJ) We talked about some of the most legendary performers, musicians ever. People like Michael Jackson, Bruce Springsteen, Whitney Houston. 3 of the greatest rappers ever. I’m going to throw you for a loop here. My 4th favorite musical act of all time. You’ve probably haven’t even heard of.
JC) Try me.
JJ) The Silversun Pickups.
JC) Who??
JJ) (laughing)
JC) Are they in Virginia somewhere? Who is this??
JJ) I knew I was gonna get that reaction.
JC) Who??
JJ) They’re a band. They’re a rock band.
JC) The Silver…what?
JJ) Like alternative rock. Out of Los Angeles.
JC) So you heard then when you came out here a few years ago?
JJ) No, no no. I started listening to them when they first started putting stuff out. The mid aughts, 2005-ish. And saw them in concert in Orlando, actually. At the Hard Rock. Got to go backstage with them. And…
JC) Are any of your family members in this band?
JJ) No…. (laughs) They’re amazing. I’ll play something for you. Don’t worry.
JC) The Silver what?
JJ) The Silversun Pickups. So you know Silver Lake, in the Los Angeles area. They’re from that area. So I guess there’s a liquor store over there, Silversun or something. So their band’s name is after this liquor store.
JC) Bubs, they can be good….. But they made your top 4?
JJ) I just… I love their music. And I have a Silversun Pickups T-shirt. It’s my favorite T-shirt.
JC) Oh god (sighing).
JJ) Look at my avi on Twitter.
JC) So you’re kind of emotionally attached to them? Is that what it is?
JJ) Their music is amazing.
JC) Okay.
JJ) They put out an album I think in early 2012. It was like their third full album. And that was the summer I lived in New York, and I rode the subway everyday form SoHo to 42nd Street. And the album played over and over. It’s basically my hype album to get me going for these workouts that I did everyday in New York. So that’s the emotional attachment for me. Not only getting to see them in person… we had some whiskey backstage….
JC) It was a great experience.
JJ) …And they signed my shirt….
JC) And they’re talented.
JJ) They’re talented. They’re awesome.
JC) You put me on to anew group.
JJ) I’ll give you a mixtape of their greatest hits.
JC) So you’ll give me a mixtape of that, and I’ll send you the YouTube of Whitney singing the anthem at the Super Bowl.
JJ) Perfect.
JC) I’m shocked that you haven’t seen that. I’ll send it to you.
JJ) Ok.
JC) Fair enough.
JJ) Our 4 favorite musical acts of all time. I love it. Alright Jamal, I really appreciate the time. I’m sorry for the 45 minutes delay with the wi-fi.
JC) I’m sorry for it too.
JJ) As always I enjoy talking to you. I wanna end with this. And I mean this sincerely. There’s a lot of guys that I’ve played with. I’ve been in the league a long time, you’ve been in the league a long time. You’ve played with a lot of guys. There’s a handful, maybe two handfuls of guys that I could confidently say, “I’m going to have a relationship with this person 15 years from now, 20 years from now”….
JC) After basketball.
JJ) After basketball. And you’re one of those guys, man. You brought it up earlier, but I didn’t know what this relationship was gonna be like 3 years ago.
JC) Yeah. This has been one of the best things…
JJ) It has been.
JC) … to come out of actually being with the Clippers. I didn’t see this coming. And we talked about this before, and we’ll definitely be friends after basketball. You can’t say that about a lot of people. Like you said, probably a handful, maybe two handfuls but…. you’re great. You really are.
JJ) You are too man. And I hope that you get a great contract this summer. I hope it’s with the Clippers.
JC) I do too.
JJ) I hope you come back, and I hope we get to continue this— this quest, man. I hope we continue this quest.
JC) Yeah. We’re knee deep in it now. Might as well keep going with it.
JJ) (laughs) Alright. Thanks Jamal.
JC) Thank you.
